Author Topic: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...  (Read 5024 times)

phichanad

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I'm on the SG defense forum and they're talking about an upcoming replacement for their Fearless class patrol vessels.

If these will be decommissioned, maybe it can be purchased by the PN...waiting for further developments...

gritpaladin

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2011, 08:52:31 PM »
Not too long ago, SG Navy retired their SeaWolf Class PB and now its the Fearless Class PB. It would be nice to have those Fearless Class PB since its 55 meters long and powered by jet propulsions, 76mm Oto Melara main gun and Mistral AA missiles and 50cal HMG

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/fearless/



is the OPV below better than the Fearless-Class? Can't identify what class is this?  Not sure if this is the Saar 4.5 OPV

http://youtu.be/Epl0soVzmJk





« Last Edit: June 18, 2011, 09:14:16 PM by gritpaladin »

Adamas

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2011, 01:56:13 AM »
Would this new design of corvette can be considered by Phil navy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGHqM25Q4Co&feature=related

atty_rcb

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2011, 02:10:04 AM »
You got pics and specs of this ship



Would this new design of corvette can be considered by Phil navy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGHqM25Q4Co&feature=related
Impossible is found in the dictionary of fools


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gritpaladin

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2011, 03:00:45 AM »
VT Shipbuilding means Vosper Thornycroft of UK.. but now its owned by Babcock International Group...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VT_Group

firstknight

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2011, 04:52:54 AM »
VT Shipbuilding means Vosper Thornycroft of UK.. but now its owned by Babcock International Group...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VT_Group


and babcock int'l group is the partner of the aboitiz group in FB Marine Aboitiz - the shipyard in Cebu that manufactures fastcraft vessel among others...

Cygnus

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2011, 05:36:40 AM »
Great news, then we can have it license built here in the Philippines
EE-T4 Ogum RECCON VEHICLE
 


The EE-T4 Reccon Vehicle is a brilliant vehicle. Quick, light armored and have it armed with a RCWS equipted with a 0.50 cal HMG and 40mm AGL combo i'm ganna be happy with it. Better yet install a 20-25mm RCWS with a co-axial 7.62mm MG to it, Hell… just perfect for the Philippine Army.

Weisel is cute but the EE-T4, makes you go Wow!!! Send a pack of them and they could drive fast and deep into the Philippine Jungle and we could clear the rebels alot sooner. Hopefully the GA or PA R&D looks into this vehicle and craft our own version of the EE-T4, calling our version "Daga" would be fitting.

Ever see a pack of rats converge on unattended meal, a sight of the EE-T4 RP version moving in would give any rebel LBM.

ignacio31

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2011, 05:58:48 AM »
Would this new design of corvette can be considered by Phil navy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGHqM25Q4Co&feature=related


No, i believe per specs specified it requires a helipad.

israeli

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2011, 06:16:47 AM »
VT Shipbuilding means Vosper Thornycroft of UK.. but now its owned by Babcock International Group...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VT_Group


the naval shipbuilding business of the former VT Group has long been taken over by BAE Systems. the unit is now called BAE Surface Ships.

the naval vessel designs that the former Vosper Thornycroft company produced are now owned by BAE Surface Ships.

what was taken over by Babcock International was the rest of the of the businesses of the VT Group.

-----

the product page of the 99m corvette on the YouTube video is at:

http://www.baesystems.com/Businesses/SurfaceShips/PlatformsandProgrammes/xCorvettes/index.htm
« Last Edit: June 19, 2011, 06:19:38 AM by israeli »
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phichanad

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2011, 07:43:18 AM »
seems that the Singaporeans are looking to replace the Fearless class with something bigger, like an OPV of local design:


israeli

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2011, 07:51:44 AM »
seems that the Singaporeans are looking to replace the Fearless class with something bigger, like an OPV of local design:



hmmmmm... something worth checking out for our own requirement? maybe! ;)

FBO solicitation for Offshore Patrol Vessel on behalf of PH

Since one of the names mentioned on the tender is Halter Marine, the US-based unit of ST Marine, it might be possible that Halter Marine can offer a variant this advanced armed OPV design by ST Marine to the PN. ;)
"I'm very determined. If I decide what something is worth doing, then I'll put my heart and soul to it. The whole ground can be against me, but if I know it is right, I'll do it. That's the business of a leader." - Lee Kuan Yew

OPSSG

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2011, 08:42:09 AM »
Below a pix of the Fearless-class vessel (in the background) on exercise with the Singapore Police Coast Guard


For more information on the Fearless-class vessels, see this two-part video on the RSS Independence (a Fearless-class vessel) below, of the ship on-patrol, just off Singapore waters:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Amdp4AnEVmk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=za-R-o6ZklY

The Fearless-class patrol vessels were built locally and attained operational status in 1997 (and it was annouced that the replacement for the the Fearless-class patrol vessels is being planned for and this class will be more than 20 years old by the time Singapore replaces them). The Fearless-class patrol vessels are propelled by waterjets instead of conventional propellers and are responsible for the coastal defence of Singapore. Five of the Fearless-class patrol vessels are armed for anti-submarine warfare missions (ASW) (one was damaged beyond economic repair in a a collision with a container ship in the Singapore Strait) and the other six for surface warfare (and can be fitted with SSMs). The ASW vessels are fitted with Thales Underwater Systems TSM 2362 Gudgeon hull-mounted medium frequency active sonar. There's nothing fancy about these vessels and they are designed with a number of specific roles in mind. If the role suits the Philippines, then it can be considered (the right tool, at the right price, for the right role).



Since 1997, the Fearless-class vessels have played a critical role in managing Malaysian attempts at intrusion in the waters around Pedra Branca and as you may know, Pedra Branca has been a source of bilateral tension between Singapore and Malaysia since 21 December 1979 (when Malaysia unilaterally redrew their maps and claimed Pedra Branca as their territory). These incidents of tension have been documented by Prof. S. Jayakumar and Prof. Tommy Koh in a 2009 book called "Pedra Branca: The Road to the World Court". I note that in 1989, the then Prime Minister of Malaysia, Dr Mahathir Mohamad (Dr M) made an unannounced visit to the vicinity of Pedra Branca. His boat was intercepted by Singapore naval vessels. To avoid an international incident, he directed his boat to leave. And yet despite Dr M's role in instigating of some of these events, in the interest of maintaining bilateral relations, LKY has said:

"And when the Youth Wing of the Malaysian Islamic Party or PAS threatened to invade Pedra Branca to plant a Malaysian flag, Dr Mahathir Mohamad stopped them and warned that it could lead to war."  

Beyond the above incidents, it is also a matter of ICJ court record that Malaysia which had in the past arrested Singapore's fishing vessels to increase tensions, including through the use of physical violence against Singapore fishermen in the vicinity of Pedra Branca. In contrast, Singapore has never arrested any Malaysian fishermen in Pedra Branca waters. Singapore's policy towards fishermen in Pedra Branca waters was clearly stated in Singapore's diplomatic note to Malaysia dated 16 June 1989:

"Singapore Marine Police and Navy patrols often find Malaysian vessels in Singapore territorial waters, fishing in what they claim to be traditional fishing grounds. Singapore has not arrested these boats. Wherever possible, it has allowed them to continue fishing. Where this is not possible for security or other reasons, the Singapore authorities have asked them to leave instead of arresting them."

Further, at page 46 of the book by Prof. Jayakumar and Prof. Koh, the two authors stated that:

"Of particular concern was a marked increase in the number of intrusions of Malaysian Government vessels in the waters around Pedra Branca. For example, from the period 1990-2000, there were some 64 incidents. However, in the next eight years from the period 2000-2008, there were a total of 563 recorded intrusions with the highest number of incidents (167) in 2007 alone. These Malaysian actions did not make any sense to us because the Court would take into account only the conduct and activities of both sides prior to the critical date."

The incidents quoted above are a clear indication of hostile intent by the Malaysian Government as they try to create 'alert fatigue' for the Singapore forces deployed there. The fact that incidents after 24 July 2003, made no legal sense at all (as that was the date both countries issued a joint notification to the Registrar of the ICJ, with regards to the agreement to adjudicate the dispute), is an indication of Malaysian hostility (which contributes to the bilateral trust deficit). Looking at the pattern of behaviour, it is clear that the Malaysians were potentially planning an incident if the ICJ ruling was unfavorable (but thankfully, UMNO were able to claim that the ICJ judgment was win-win). Just because the Singapore Government and Singapore media outlets do not play-up these Malaysian initiated incidents from 2000-2008 does not mean that it was not happening. The SAF needed to be prepared for the relevant contingency that may arise from Malaysian actions with the appropriate escalation options to deter them.

BTW, Singapore has developed a command, control and communiations system, called the RSN's ACCESS System. This ACCESS System fosters closer cooperation between the RSN and foreign navies. It's essentially a roll-on command, control and communications module that is paid for by Singapore, to bring onto a foreign navy ship, on exercise with the RSN. RSN's ACCESS System provides navy ships with a common sea situation picture between navy ships in multilateral exercises, allowing commanders access to information to make better informed decisions. This also includes a online-chat feature and file transfer capability. This means that foreign navies on exercise with the RSN do not have to pay for the ACCESS System to train with our navy guys. If Philippines is serious about building up your navy's ASW capabilities, try to work with navies, like the RSN, that can be of help to your guys (and we have a couple of diesel electric submarines your navy can train against in exercises).

Taking training seriously just takes commitment (which is clearly demonstrated on the two-part video). phichanad, you should watch the two-part video to get an idea of the operational role of these Fearless-class vessels. I hope this post and the video links provided helps clarify.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2011, 10:59:33 AM by OPSSG »

bustero

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2011, 10:22:11 AM »
In general, does not seem to have long legs. Well armed for a small boat but seems to be more like an interceptor plus with that set up looks expensive to run. Suppose it would also depend on the price.

OPSSG

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2011, 10:37:41 AM »
In general, does not seem to have long legs. Well armed for a small boat but seems to be more like an interceptor plus with that set up looks expensive to run. Suppose it would also depend on the price.

The RSN tends to have very well armed vessels, which would mean that these coastal defence vessels would have short legs (and more specifically limited endurance). Singapore usually tries to save money by working on reduced manning (via automation) but I'm sure you guys would have different concerns. Water jets are for specific shallow water operational needs, which I don't think your guys will need in an EEZ patrol vessel.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2011, 11:02:22 AM by OPSSG »

Adamas

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Re: Singapore Fearless Class PV for possible early retirement...
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2011, 06:15:58 PM »

No, i believe per specs specified it requires a helipad.

Sir It had helicopter deck.
from http://www.baesystems.com/Businesses/SurfaceShips/PlatformsandProgrammes/xCorvettes/index.htm
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